diff --git a/crates/collab-net/src/driver.rs b/crates/collab-net/src/driver.rs
index b2b4d307..32f66b1b 100644
--- a/crates/collab-net/src/driver.rs
+++ b/crates/collab-net/src/driver.rs
@@ -18,6 +18,7 @@
 
 use figcraft_collab::message::{self, ClientMsg, PROTOCOL, Presence, Resolve, ServerMsg};
 use figcraft_engine::live::{Event, Status};
+use std::time::Duration;
 // `std::time::Instant` on native builds; the browser's clock in the web build.
 use web_time::Instant;
 
@@ -25,6 +26,7 @@ use crate::exchange::{self, Exchange, Then};
 use crate::inbox::Inbox;
 use crate::invite::Endpoint;
 use crate::join::{GuestConfig, Next, Outcome, Resuming, Seen, Taken, after, closed, hello, resolved, take, too_large, unresolved};
+use crate::limits::NetLimits;
 use crate::requests::Publish;
 use crate::throttle::{PRESENCE_INTERVAL, Throttle, earliest};
 
@@ -55,6 +57,13 @@ impl Conn {
     fn new(now: Instant) -> Self {
         Self { started: now, opened: false, welcomed: false, seen: Seen::default(), last_ping: now, last_heard: now }
     }
+
+    /// How long the host may stay silent. Until the welcome is whole, the document is arriving as
+    /// one message that doesn't count as heard before it is complete, so a large file on a slow
+    /// link gets the long reply timeout instead of the idle one.
+    fn silence_limit(&self, l: &NetLimits) -> Duration {
+        if self.welcomed { l.idle_timeout } else { l.request_reply_timeout }
+    }
 }
 
 /// A joined (or joining) session over a [`Socket`].
@@ -315,7 +324,7 @@ impl<S: Socket> Driver<S> {
             // A managing connection waits for each answer.
             (true, true) => [Some(c.last_heard + l.request_reply_timeout), None, None],
             (true, false) => {
-                [Some(c.last_ping + l.keepalive), Some(c.last_heard + l.idle_timeout), if c.welcomed { self.throttle.due() } else { None }]
+                [Some(c.last_ping + l.keepalive), Some(c.last_heard + c.silence_limit(l)), if c.welcomed { self.throttle.due() } else { None }]
             }
         });
         earliest(conn.into_iter().flatten().chain([self.reconnect_at]))
@@ -332,7 +341,7 @@ impl<S: Socket> Driver<S> {
         }
         let l = self.cfg.limits;
         let Some(c) = self.conn.as_ref() else { return };
-        let (opened, started, last_heard, last_ping) = (c.opened, c.started, c.last_heard, c.last_ping);
+        let (opened, started, last_heard, last_ping, silence) = (c.opened, c.started, c.last_heard, c.last_ping, c.silence_limit(&l));
         if !opened {
             if now >= started + self.cfg.connect_timeout {
                 self.dropped(format!("no answer from {}", self.server().display()), now);
@@ -345,7 +354,7 @@ impl<S: Socket> Driver<S> {
             }
             return;
         }
-        if now >= last_heard + l.idle_timeout {
+        if now >= last_heard + silence {
             return self.end(Outcome::Retry("the host stopped answering".into()), now);
         }
         let ok = self.throttle.take_due(now).is_none_or(|p| self.write(&ClientMsg::Presence(p)));
diff --git a/crates/collab-net/src/driver_tests.rs b/crates/collab-net/src/driver_tests.rs
index a94ff064..ea790074 100644
--- a/crates/collab-net/src/driver_tests.rs
+++ b/crates/collab-net/src/driver_tests.rs
@@ -184,6 +184,38 @@ fn pings_go_out_while_presence_does_and_the_pongs_keep_the_connection() {
     assert!(pings >= 5, "a ping every 15 s ({pings})");
 }
 
+#[test]
+fn a_welcome_still_downloading_gets_the_long_reply_timeout() {
+    let t0 = Instant::now();
+    let (mut d, inbox) = start(Script::default(), t0);
+    d.opened(t0);
+    let limits = GuestConfig::new(invite(), "Ada".into()).limits;
+    // The welcome (the whole document) is one message that is not heard until complete: past the
+    // idle timeout the join must not be given up.
+    let past_idle = t0 + limits.idle_timeout + Duration::from_secs(1);
+    d.tick(past_idle);
+    assert!(!d.done());
+    assert_eq!(d.sock.closes, 0);
+    assert_eq!(statuses(&inbox.drain()), vec![Status::Connecting]);
+    // It does arrive; from then on a silent host is dropped at the idle timeout.
+    d.message(&welcome(), past_idle);
+    let silent = past_idle + limits.idle_timeout;
+    d.tick(silent - ms(1));
+    assert_eq!(d.sock.closes, 0);
+    d.tick(silent);
+    assert_eq!(d.sock.closes, 1);
+}
+
+#[test]
+fn a_host_that_never_welcomes_is_given_up_on_at_the_reply_timeout() {
+    let t0 = Instant::now();
+    let (mut d, _inbox) = start(Script::default(), t0);
+    d.opened(t0);
+    let limit = t0 + GuestConfig::new(invite(), "Ada".into()).limits.request_reply_timeout;
+    d.tick(limit);
+    assert_eq!(d.sock.closes, 1);
+}
+
 #[test]
 fn a_silent_host_counts_as_dropped_and_the_client_reconnects() {
     let t0 = Instant::now();
diff --git a/docs/collab-protocol.md b/docs/collab-protocol.md
index 4ddef04d..cdc441f6 100644
--- a/docs/collab-protocol.md
+++ b/docs/collab-protocol.md
@@ -695,7 +695,9 @@ resuming with its offline edits, and leaving the session going back to snapshot
   (resuming as the same client after a drop), presence held until the welcome and changes made
   for an earlier connection dropped (the sync client sends them again once caught up), presence throttled to about 30 updates a second
   (latest wins), a `Ping` after 15 s without sending (browsers don't expose WebSocket ping frames;
-  the host answers `Pong`), a connection silent for 45 s counted as dropped, reconnects with the
+  the host answers `Pong`), a connection silent for 45 s counted as dropped (5 minutes before the
+  welcome: it carries the whole document as one message, which a large file on a slow link takes
+  a while to download, and nothing counts as heard until it is complete), reconnects with the
   same growing pauses after a live connection drops, refusals and the end of the session final,
   and a first join that can't reach the host failing at once. The browser layer only feeds it the
   socket's events and one `setTimeout` for its next deadline, and every arrival wakes egui